I have had my Pro C25 for over a month now. Am I happy with it? Yes, very much so. If I had known parts had been made in Korea and then assembled over here
would I have bought it? I don't know. The main reason I bought it is because it is solid wood, side back and top. And I liked the sound and feel of it,
even after trying Taylor, Martin, and Gibson. By the way Gibson is now selling a guitar that is made in Canada. However they are saying it is made in Canada.
Bottom line, how do I feel? I love the guitar. How do I feel about Breedlove? I think they could have went about this in a better manner. This whole thing
leaves a bad taste in people's mouth. As said in one of the other posts I would like to hear from Breedlove as to how they receive the parts from Korea and
what they have to do to finish the guitar. Something else to consider, I don't think that anything you buy nowadays is 100% made in the USA. Even my Harley
has non USA parts on it. On the positive side, I still think Breelove makes a quality product. As a matter of fact, I just bought a Breedlove Atlas AC25/SR 12
string Plus.
0 Kudo
Breedlove Pro Series - Where are they really made?
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 wheatlands |
where are they made | #41 | ||
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Parlor
Posts: 22 March 19, 2008 06:11:47 |
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Greg F |
#42 | |||
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000
Posts: 335 March 19, 2008 07:13:54
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My C25....Completely made in the USA...Has wood from all over the world in it. This dosen't seem to bother anyone when it comes to guitars. As a matter of fact, the more exotic the wood......the bigger the price we are willing to pay. My point is it dosen't matter where it's parts are from. When a guitar is built at the breedlove shop in Oregon it is made by people that are dedicated to their craft. I've been there and have seen first hand the love these people have for creating a quality instrument and satisfying each and every customer that purchase one of their instruments. Anything that is brought in from outside has to pass breedlove's strict quality control before being used. Last time we were there our kids were given some pads that come inside the guitar case that did not meet the standards. Some might find that a little picky but that's the way they operate. And by the way...we were told that when they get these in and can't use them they donate them to the local animal shelter for pads in the cages. I have owned a business where out sourcing became necessary in order to maintain the highest quality product and maybe....that's what should be looked at...the highest quality product they can give us. As for Ovations....I own a 1974 Ballader. Bought it new. $249.00 !! The guitar has been thru ##@$%^&^&!! and it may not be the prettiest one in my stable it is one of the best sounding and gets better as time goes by. |
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stevezenof |
Finally discovered the answer | #43 | ||
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Parlor
Posts: 11 July 1, 2008 19:53:49 |
Re: the original question I posted earlier this year questioning where the Breedlove Pro Series are truly made, I discovered the answer in Breedlove's new catalog posted on their Web site as a PDF.
Apparently the same details also apply to the new Root Series.
The catalog says:
60% - Handcrafted at the (USA) Breedlove Custom Shop (including gloss finish, custom shop bridges, fretwork, assembly and stringup processes)
33% - Handcrafted in Korea (including one-piece necks and all solid tonewoods from the Pacific Northwest, India, Indonesia and Africa)
7% - Made in Japan, Germany and Canada (including Gotoh tuning machines from Japan, German fretwire, Canadian nut & saddle) Thought it might be helpful to pass this along and close the loop. Best regards.
Last Edited By: stevezenof November 23, 2008 19:35:11.
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Capt06 |
Thanks for the info. | #44 | ||
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Parlor
Posts: 72 July 1, 2008 23:03:05 |
I really wish Breedlove would have noted this earlier but it doesn't really make a difference in what the guitar is; that being a great instrument. Other
that a little buzz issue I resolved, it has been awesome.
I have pondered this topic and its implications and did have to ill thoughts of it. Since then I have thought about it further and applied some reasoning from my business courses related to Breedlove's venture with these guitars. They did a pretty good move by bridging the gap between their Atlas and Customs without having to greatly expand thier USA operation. They are a company focused on custom produced products with some high production models that they put alot of input into added in the mix. Another way of looking at it is these guitars probly would not have been available otherwise. It would have required a significant investment of captial and risk on the part of Breedlove to introduce a all USA made line like the Pro and Roots series. Since they have a very good relationship with an quality asian builder the introduction and utiliztion makes more sense to me now. Thanks again for the info. |
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jgeikler |
This is about branding | #45 | ||
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Parlor
Posts: 12 July 2, 2008 13:43:26 |
I don't think anyone disputes the fact that the Pro series was a brilliant business move and that offshore sourcing allows them to provide a high quality
instrument for those of use who can't (yet) or are not willing to step up to the custom or performance series. I think everyone agrees the this produce
really hits a sweat spot (it did for me). The problem I have is how they market it, their ad states that the guitar was made in the USA and in fact that is a
partial truth. Breedlove has work long and hard to over many years to earn the reputation as a high end, trustworthy, custom builder, at least thats my
perception of their "brand" based on what I've read and the guitars I have played. When I saw their ad state that they had a new low end US
version I got excited. I've played their Atlas series and although nice, weren't anything to get excited about. When I saw the ad I went out to
specifically play the C25/CR pro, I did get excited and eventually bought it! Everything was great until I got it home and took a close look and found a big
old scratch under the finish, I was pretty shocked. (I'm still waiting for my replacement from GC). My perception of their "Brand" has dropped
significantly. It's not the perception I had of an "American Made" Breedlove when I started out to purchase this product. I think they are
gambling their reputation when they choose to use the "Made in America" tag line on a produce that will be compared to their other US offerings, not
the Atlas lines. This smells a bit of bate and switch. They could have just say it like it is " this instrument utilizes the best of all worlds, Koreas
world class production facilities with Breedlove's famous custom fine tuning, setup and finishing to provide a instrument that just cannot be touch in its
price range". I'd be right there!!! When you start telling these half truths you have to start wondering what else is not quite above board.
Breedlove's marketing dept. should have never excepted this ad campaign from their agency. I think its time for a new agency, I don't think they
understand the produce, the guitar is so damn good you just need to play and compare it to the competition in that price range and you'll walk out of the
store with it.
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Capt06 |
#46 | |||
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Parlor
Posts: 72 July 2, 2008 21:35:55 |
You summed it up there. Sure the marketing thing is questiionable but ultimately it is a very good production guitar. I A&B'd it with the Taylor GS8, 814, 414, and 714. It was close to the 714 but the C25 was better for my ears. This guitar just projects a full balanced tone and resonance that should not happen in a concert body but Breedlove has that charateristic. Bottom line to me is the results I seee in how how it inspires creativity in my music. |
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Jaykay321 |
#47 | |||
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Parlor
Posts: 8 August 3, 2008 18:28:20 |
Like most of the responses here, I too agree that while I find the semantics employed by Breedlove to be misleading, ulitmately I am happy with the sound and
quality. Looks like the questions have been answered, but I thought I'd share my story.
I was intent on buying a USA made acoustic and after doing months of research and playing had finally found the tone I wanted in a D25 Pro. Luckily for me, one of the salesman (an honest salesman, imagine that!) alluded to the fact that the Pro Series was "partially made in Korea." I went ahead and called Breedlove and I was told that it was about 60% made in the USA and that after much discussion and debate, that simple majority was enough for Breedlove to decide that the guitars should be branded as American made. At this point I was pretty disappointed. I thought it was a pretty underhanded thing to do and felt it was straight up false advertisement. I guess there is a general bias (in many cases justified) against non-usa made guitars. However after playing some more, I simply could not find a guitar that I liked better than the Breedlove. I think what really sealed the deal for me was one day I was at Guitar Center and picked up a $3000 Breedlove (performance series i think), which looked identical to the D25 Pro. I played both, and I couldn't hear any sort of difference between the two. This just showed me that despite its hybrid origins, the quality and overall craftsmanship were top notch. I'd love to be able to drop the cash on a higher end breedlove one of these days, but for now the Pro Series is where you get the most bang for your buck. |
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Capt06 |
I've chased this rabbit..... | #48 | ||
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Parlor
Posts: 72 August 3, 2008 23:00:17 |
and I know where you are coming from. This guitar (my C25 Pro) has a tone I have looked for a very long time. I have have not heard it in any other builder other than Breedlove. I have heard some simularities in others but Breedlove has a tonal package like no other. This guitar's tone is far and above it's price (way far and above). I've had mine a year and it still gets to me. |
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TxStrat |
I guess it's my fault for not doing more research.... | #49 | ||
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Parlor
Posts: 1 August 7, 2008 23:50:12 |
I am extremly disappointed. I thought I was buying my first "Made in the USA" acoustic guitar. I have saved for a long time, and looked long and
hard. I'm not disappointed with the sound... But I assure you, I would NOT have bought this guitar if I had known that it was "kinda sorta" made
in the USA. I have only had it a couple of weeks and I am seriously considering taking it back to GC. OH..... and I keep reading how it's a great guitar
for 1500.00. I paid 1699.00 for my C25\CRH at GC.
Sounds like I got ripped off. |
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Jaykay321 |
#50 | |||
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Parlor
Posts: 8 August 8, 2008 00:54:17 |
TxStrat wrote: It looks like you paid the "list price" which I've seen range from $1599 to $1699 which also includes the official breedlove case. I'm
not sure if I'd use as strong a term as "ripped off", but from my experience you should never pay the list price at GC, simply because you
don't have to. I've always haggled at GC myself, and despite hearing from numerous sources (including GC employees themselves) that there is no more
"dealing" or haggling due to "new management", I can tell you that you just have to find the right salesperson willing to play ball. And
trust me, there will always be at least a few of them that will.
Of course if you simply walk in, and pick up a guitar and say, "I'd like to buy this" then they're obviously not going to offer you a deal. It's all about acting like you're somewhat interested in the guitar, but couldn't care less if you didn't take it home that day. If you have another large chain, eg: Sam Ash, then get a quote from them and have the other place beat it. It's your hard earned dollar at the end of the day and this is business. Get the most bang for your buck. I don't know how many GC's you have around you....BUT if you *can* return it, you could always buy it again at another GC, this time asking for a deal.
Last Edited By: Jaykay321 August 8, 2008 00:58:02.
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Capt06 |
Be happy. Don't live with regret. | #51 | ||
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Parlor
Posts: 72 August 8, 2008 21:30:23 |
I know where you are coming from.
If you don't feel good about your deal or the guitar, you may not ever. Better to have regret and cash in the hand than regret and guitar you might regret buying. Based on the price you paid your not a tremendous amount from a discounted S series. I've seen a few that were about $600 above what you paid. As far as where the guitar is made; at the heart of it is a guitar that would not have happened otherwise and it seems Breedlove has taken "some" efforts put more info about the origin. The documentation I see now states it is 60% USA made( not on the label though). That means 40% was done overseas which probly 80-90% automated and 60% was done in Oregon which is probly 90-95% critical hands work. Anyway it works for me. Still one of the best sounding guitars I've played. |
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MandoSquirrel |
#52 | |||
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Concert
Posts: 1850 August 9, 2008 12:16:22
Mandolin
moderator 
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In Breedlove's defence, apparently the most crucial part of the work, making sure the guitars are the best they can be, seems to be done at the home
facility in Oregon. I've tried at least one Pro series(2 or more occasions, maybe the same box, maybe not), & found it very close to the $3000 & up
guitars.
I agree, the marketing should be clearer about the origin, but how many guitars are this good at this price? Maybe Guild for totally American made, & one or two others, if that. Certainly not Martin or Gibson.
Mandolins;
Breedlove Cascade; Victoria, B&J New York ; Washburn 215 bowl back, cr.1906-07; cheap Romanian Mandola; Flatiron by Gibson pancake(currently untunable, after "repair"attempt ). Guitar: Guild D-25NT. |
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steam furnace |
#53 | |||
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Parlor
Posts: 11 December 17, 2008 14:53:06 |
"Assembled in the USA" would be more accurate, as I have seen on some TV sets from RCA and Magnavox (Philips.) I am confident that my Taylor 414ce
and Martin HD-7 were both entirely U.S. made. I do, however, own a Japanese '62 Custom Fender Telecaster that would put some of the U.S. versions to
shame, and a Mexican Deluxe Player's Stratocaster that is equal to some of the American Standards. That being said, I KNEW before I bought them where they
were made. If I am going to spend over $1,500 for a "Made in USA" guitar, I want it to really be 100% made, NOT assembled in the USA.
Last Edited By: steam furnace December 17, 2008 14:58:53.
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Capt06 |
#54 | |||
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Parlor
Posts: 72 December 21, 2008 19:58:34 |
Just a thought but the rosewood is East Indian and other woods are likely cut and milled offshore and the tuners come from you knows where; as well as some
other components. This could be said about guitars from any builder regardless of where their label says they are built. Essentially the guitars are built up
of components by skilled hands. So if the wood, tuners or strings are originate off-shore, I think it is auguable about "100%". I have guitars from
Taylor and Martin as well and my Pro, comparably, is as exceptionable in tone and playabilty as those. My earlier objections to Breedloves use of Made in USA
are well documented in other replies. However, these earlier objections have been resolved given a better perspective of Breedlove's development and
production of the Pro series.
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WCRefLib |
#55 | |||
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Parlor
Posts: 12 December 22, 2008 17:39:57 |
I haven't been following Breedlove's activities too much since acquiring my '06 OMM Revival last year. The OMM was more expensive than my
'04 Martin OM-18V, which CFM discontinued last year. If you think Martins are expensive, the 100% U.S.A.-made Revivals actually cost as much as a OM-28
Marquis and 000-18GE at 40% off list.
WCRefLib
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Capt06 |
#56 | |||
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Parlor
Posts: 72 December 22, 2008 22:30:33 |
You bring up a good point. Martin and Taylor's most produced, seen, and available products are their USA models. I would say the opposite is the case for
Breedlove. Even though the company is built and focused on their domestic products, they are most represented by their imports. Very interesting.
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powerandwisdom |
#57 | |||
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Gatekeeper Slope Shoulder
Posts: 2395 December 23, 2008 07:25:42
Guitar & Technique
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The OMM was more expensive than my '04 Martin OM-18V, which CFM discontinued last year. If you think Martins are expensive, the 100% U.S.A.-made Revivals actually cost as much as a OM-28 Marquis and 000-18GE at 40% off list.Having spent considerable time with each of these models, I believe the Revival Deluxe compares favorably with the Martin OM-28 Marquis and the GE. The big difference in construction is the execution of the neck joint. The Martins have a traditional dove-tail design, while the Revival is a bolt-on. This is a complete non-factor for me although for others it's a big issue. As far as build quality, Breedlove gives nothing up to Martin IMO and is perhaps a notch ahead (my opinion of course). Tone and playability are subjective factors of course. For me (and I like Martins), the V-neck shape on those Martins is intolerable, while the Breedlove's low profile C-shape is very comfortable. The OM-18V is a bit of a different beast (sitka top/bracing) versus red spruce top/bracing of the Revival Deluxe. I agree - clarity about materials/assembly origins for the Pro series was a confusing when the series debuted. Education is not filling a bucket, but lighting a
fire. -William Butler Yeats
Last Edited By: powerandwisdom December 23, 2008 07:31:37.
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